Automation of Same Colored Controls In Same Area Challenge

[Todd R]

Well, for many years I have been singing the praises of what I have always considered the best automation design of any DAW,
I have come upon a situation that gives good reason for automation events per parameter to live in its own lane.

My project is surround and I'm using two different reverbs;
rvb 1 feeds L&R whose destination are Out 1 and Out 2;
rvb 2 feeds Ls&Rs on Out 5 and Out 6

what I didn't realize is I have to mix the auxs as the input tracks appear to be pre channel fader to the aux.
It seems to require a lot of extra steps because to automate the respective returns' volume slider,
V-key filter needs to be applied before the ability to write an offline fade to the slider.
Biggest issue, the color coding of the automation events are the same
if the events were in their own lane, copy and paste would be pretty easy
I probably should just create some new custom automations and add to my gallery

I just must have something set not as I need on the input tracks where the fx comps are

my point is, that this overlay design of SAW automation which I love has now revealed to me
for the first time that maybe there's a reason for the other DAWs to stick with one lane per automated parameter

[Todd R]

Well, for many years I have been singing the praises of what I have always considered the best automation design of any DAW,
I have come upon a situation that gives good reason for automation events per parameter to live in its own lane.

My project is surround and I'm using two different reverbs;
rvb 1 feeds L&R whose destination are Out 1 and Out 2;
rvb 2 feeds Ls&Rs on Out 5 and Out 6

what I didn't realize is I have to mix the auxs as the input tracks appear to be pre channel fader to the aux.
It seems to require a lot of extra steps because to automate the respective returns' volume slider,
V-key filter needs to be applied before the ability to write an offline fade to the slider.
Biggest issue, the color coding of the automation events are the same
if the events were in their own lane, copy and paste would be pretty easy
I probably should just create some new custom automations and add to my gallery

I just must have something set not as I need on the input tracks where the fx comps are

my point is, that this overlay design of SAW automation which I love has now revealed to me
for the first time that maybe there's a reason for the other DAWs to stick with one lane per automated parameter

ok, you know what, I'm being silly...the events aren't that difficult to see when multitrack lanes are taller...
yeah, just have to make some automation events and add to the automation library

[Todd R]

ya know!
I take it back
don't really need to create automation library entries
it's pretty rudimentary to edit directly in the multitrack

and is certainly less cumbersome than a screen cluttered with parameter automation lanes

[Todd R]

OK, hey kids
saving automation to the gallery is the way to go!
mark a fade and insert and bang, the fades timed together
no other DAW I know of can do this

[cgrafx]

what I didn't realize is I have to mix the auxs as the input tracks appear to be pre channel fader to the aux.

Don't know if this helps you, but you do know that AUX's can be pre or post fader.

Just Select PST on the FDR button next the IN button.

[Todd R]

Don't know if this helps you, but you do know that AUX's can be pre or post fader.

Just Select PST on the FDR button next the IN button.

thanks for this Philip!

I didn't know where to set pre/ post for aux
as soon as I read this, it dawned on me
and default is Pst not selected...oh, man

thanks! duh, that will save lots of time

[Dave Labrecque]

Idea that you probably don't need at this point, but maybe someday?

Use two Auxes or duplicate source tracks to separate the same-colored automation, lowering (offsetting) the level of each 6 dB.

[MMP]

And don.t forget you can use the view filter to display and isolate one type of automation even if there are multiple types of the same color on a track.

[Todd R]

And don.t forget you can use the view filter to display and isolate one type of automation even if there are multiple types of the same color on a track.

How else would a user edit those multiple overlaid events?

Just to create automatic fades for the AUX sliders, user must set the filter for whatever parameter is having the automated fade created.
If user doesn't invoke the automation type filter (V-key) and tries to create an automated fade, likely a different parameter will have an automated fade applied.
Depending upon zoom level, all kindsa mistakes can happen; (usually input channel fades IME)

I realize the auto fade is written for whatever the next parameter is (next event in front of the play cursor/ playhead). Invoke the V filter and assure precise auto fade creation.

[Todd R]

Idea that you probably don't need at this point, but maybe someday?

Use two Auxes or duplicate source tracks to separate the same-colored automation, lowering (offsetting) the level of each 6 dB.

sure, of course, I do this all the time :-) This is the bread and butter of editing automation in SS, innit?

And kind of points users to using the automation gallery because automation gallery is pretty fast and ensures user gets what they want if user labels wisely.

Thing is, using SS, I'm going to be beyond max of aux channels easily if needing 8 different reverbs for L+R and Ls+Rs interior and exterior reverbs.
And I have auxs already (mis)used...I used them as fx busses for checkerboarded dialog...So I'm finding myself back at square one again....sigh

I probably have to completely re-route all my output busses and try the SS surround panning...or...
I've been feeding inputs to output subs to output subs and then to 5.1 (L1, R2, C3, LFE4, Ls5, Rs6)
then I was planning to make multis in another software

[MMP]

Sorry for stating the obvious.

How else would a user edit those multiple overlaid events?

Just to create automatic fades for the AUX sliders, user must set the filter for whatever parameter is having the automated fade created.
If user doesn't invoke the automation type filter (V-key) and tries to create an automated fade, likely a different parameter will have an automated fade applied.
Depending upon zoom level, all kindsa mistakes can happen; (usually input channel fades IME)

I realize the auto fade is written for whatever the next parameter is (next event in front of the play cursor/ playhead). Invoke the V filter and assure precise auto fade creation.

[Todd R]

Sorry for stating the obvious.

no problem at all, no need to be sorry :-)

I missed the obvious in the first place! Thank goodness y'all are willing to state the obvious ;-P

[Dave Labrecque]

How else would a user edit those multiple overlaid events?

Just to create automatic fades for the AUX sliders, user must set the filter for whatever parameter is having the automated fade created.
If user doesn't invoke the automation type filter (V-key) and tries to create an automated fade, likely a different parameter will have an automated fade applied.
Depending upon zoom level, all kindsa mistakes can happen; (usually input channel fades IME)

I realize the auto fade is written for whatever the next parameter is (next event in front of the play cursor/ playhead). Invoke the V filter and assure precise auto fade creation.

And IIRC the simplest way to activate your filter of choice is to move to the nearest automation entry of that type and hit the V key. I get lost in that big ol' automation selection drop-down (pop-up?). This approach, of course, requires that that type of entry currently exists in your session.

[UpTilDawn]

And IIRC the simplest way to activate your filter of choice is to move to the nearest automation entry of that type and hit the V key... This approach, of course, requires that that type of entry currently exists in your session.

... and that there isn't a stack of entries sitting on top of each other (I tend to make numerous adjustments to a set of parameters all at once and not one, move the cursor a smidge, adjust another, etc. - like turning an aux on and adjusting the level of it at one time, within a marked area, for instance.).

[MMP]

I just write a dummy event of thebtype I need for the filter and delete it afterwards.

[Todd R]

And IIRC the simplest way to activate your filter of choice is to move to the nearest automation entry of that type and hit the V key.

This is how I invoke the filter :-)

I get lost in that big ol' automation selection drop-down (pop-up?). This approach, of course, requires that that type of entry currently exists in your session.

Oh, hmmmm, I forgot about this
I'll have a look at that automation selection pop-up...it exists?

oh my, I forgot about this, thanks, Dave! Well, lo and behold this answers my OP!!!
from the manual:
"[Right-Clicking] the Aut button displays a popup filter menu of every automation data type.Selecting one of these options sets the View Filter ON for that data type. If the View Filter is
already active when displaying this menu, the current filter data type will be checked. A special
feature allows all Fx plug-in automation data types to be shown at once if the cursor position is
not directly behind an Fx automation data type when selecting this option. If the last tracked
data type is an Fx automation type, only that specific type will be displayed."

[Dave Labrecque]

... and that there isn't a stack of entries sitting on top of each other (I tend to make numerous adjustments to a set of parameters all at once and not one, move the cursor a smidge, adjust another, etc. - like turning an aux on and adjusting the level of it at one time, within a marked area, for instance.).

A quick zoom separates confounding entries, no? Ctrl-tab to an entry of your automation type of choice, hit V, then you can offset a marked area of that type.

[Dave Labrecque]

"...A special feature allows all Fx plug-in automation data types to be shown at once if the cursor position is
not directly behind an Fx automation data type when selecting this option. If the last tracked
data type is an Fx automation type, only that specific type will be displayed."

I don't understand this bit. :confused:

[Todd R]

I don't understand this bit. :confused:

Me neither! Does this mean if play cursor is beyond/ after (on the timeline) all automation events, then user can view all automation with the V-Key filter still applied?
I dunno, I tried a few experiments, didn't get anywhere

really, I'd very much to appreciate the ability exclude parameters, say, channel fader...
instead users end up doing a fair bit of workaround for that;
i.e.: move channel volume fader to another track (up or down)>
carry out other edits Like eq/ auxs/ etc
then move fader automation back to channel

really, I like the pop-up dialog to ensure my V-Filter is on my desired parameter, that is quite powerful IMO

[Todd R]

OK, let me just say, thank goodness y'all are around to discuss this stuff =-D
thanks for all the responses

So, I'm needing to transfer automation from a RETURN channel to an OUTPUT channel.
There's not that much to do, yet as all know, the automation events cannot just be copied
over from INPUT, OUTPUT, RETURN tracks because they are incompatible.
This is where the V-Key filter comes into play and allows automatic fade creation...that I didn't necessarily know before this thread, so thanks to everyone who responded.